#social 2015-02-24

2015-02-24 UTC
tilgovi and AnnB joined the channel
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Loqi Abasset made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82098&oldid=82097
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Loqi Abasset made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82101&oldid=82098
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82103&oldid=82101
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AnnB for the record -- Starting with "Integration: New social capability with zero cost" -- I'm now registering votes for us, without Adam's participation since he's out all week. He may come on late tonight and edit my contributions.
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Loqi Abasset made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82104&oldid=82103
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82106&oldid=82104
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AnnB when one edits the wiki ... what happens differently if you check "this is a minor edit"?
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Loqi Abasset made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82109&oldid=82106
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82111&oldid=82109
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82113&oldid=82111
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82115&oldid=82113
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Loqi Abasset made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82119&oldid=82115
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Loqi Abasset made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82125&oldid=82119
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Loqi Aaronpk made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82124&oldid=82120
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82126&oldid=82125
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Loqi Abasset made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82127&oldid=82126
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Loqi Aaronpk made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82131&oldid=82128
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82130&oldid=82127
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82132&oldid=82131
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Loqi Abasset made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82135&oldid=82132
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82137&oldid=82135
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ben_thatmustbeme Melvster. I believe voting is limited to members of the WG but we accepted stories from all over. If you have any others for us capture, let us know.
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82139&oldid=82137
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Loqi Akuckart made 5 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82144&oldid=82139
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Loqi Akuckart made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82146&oldid=82144
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Loqi Akuckart made 7 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82153&oldid=82146
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Loqi Tantekelik made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82154&oldid=82153
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Loqi Akuckart made 5 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82161&oldid=82154
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Loqi Tantekelik made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82162&oldid=82155
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Loqi Akuckart made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82163&oldid=82162
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melvster ben_thatmustbeme: happy with the voting and dont have time to join, but modern social systems would benefit from messaging and realtime messaging aka chat, imho ... just look at how facebook works
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Loqi Kmarks2 made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82167&oldid=82163
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Loqi Kmarks2 made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82171&oldid=82167
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ben_thatmustbeme melvster, I agree, a cross system real time chat would be great, but seems to be biting off more than we can chew for a first iteration. I would love to see that happen though.
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Loqi Eprodrom made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82172&oldid=82171
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Loqi Akuckart made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82186&oldid=82185
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Loqi Eprodrom made 13 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82185&oldid=82172
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Loqi Eprodrom made 9 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82198&oldid=82186
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Loqi Akuckart made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82197&oldid=82190
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Loqi Eprodrom made 10 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82214&oldid=82198
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Loqi Akuckart made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82213&oldid=82201
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82204&oldid=82203
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eprodrom finished voting!
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aaronpk wow congrats
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aaronpk i'm about half way through, trying to plough through a bunch this morning
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eprodrom Yes, it would have been nice if we could have had a little more collaborative editing process
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eprodrom Having to review 90 user stories when we were counting on 5-10 makes things pretty tedious
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Loqi Eprodrom made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82215&oldid=82214
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Loqi Akuckart made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82218&oldid=82217
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Loqi Aaronpk made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82219&oldid=82215
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bret morning!
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Loqi Akuckart made 5 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82225&oldid=82219
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82222&oldid=82221
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rhiaro Ughhhh spent so long voting without saving that my login timed out *and* now I have a merge conflict >.>
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aaronpk thats why i've been doing one at a time :/
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aaronpk rhiaro: you should be able to see your diffs in the merge conflict screen though
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rhiaro yes, but I have to go through and paste them all back in
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rhiaro sighs
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aaronpk yeah :(
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rhiaro This is what I get for leaving it to the last minute..
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aaronpk i'm only half way through still
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rhiaro Seeing other peoples' comments first has been helpful in many cases though
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aaronpk at leaast we have until midnight tonight
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rhiaro yeah I'm up to 51
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rhiaro I was hoping to finish before the call, should have heeded everyone's warnings about how long this would take..
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rhiaro Midnight US time?
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aaronpk i think midnight EST?
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aaronpk checks minutes
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Loqi Akuckart made 5 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82233&oldid=82225
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Loqi Aaronpk made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82232&oldid=82229
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Loqi Eprodrom made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82228&oldid=82227
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aaronpk yes
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eprodrom rhiaro: bummer
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aaronpk updated wiki
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rhiaro mediawiki definitely needs a better way to resolve merge conflicts
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aaronpk no argument there
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Loqi Rhiaro made 8 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82247&oldid=82233
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Loqi Akuckart made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82246&oldid=82235
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Loqi Aaronpk made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82242&oldid=82237
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rhiaro aaronpk how does Loqi decide to group edits together?
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aaronpk loqi just checks on a cron job
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aaronpk and groups by author based on the last time he checked
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rhiaro oh cool. How frequently does he check?
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aaronpk looks like every 10 minutes
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rhiaro aaronpk, just seen that you're replying to the user stories on your site - nice!
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aaronpk :)
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aaronpk I wanted to make sure I don't lose the comments I'm making
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Loqi Akuckart made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82255&oldid=82247
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Loqi Bret made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82257&oldid=82256
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Loqi Aaronpk made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82258&oldid=82249
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Loqi Rhiaro made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82254&oldid=82248
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bret if you edit a subsection of the page, does that conflict with someone else editing a different subsection?
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aaronpk apparently not
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bret doh!
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rhiaro aaargh, endless edit conflicts all of a sudden
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rhiaro will try subsections..
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bret rhiaro: ahh im sorry
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bret i was dipping in and out of subsections
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rhiaro maybe I'll start at the bottom
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bret fwiw, im typing into a text editor, clicking edit, pasting and saving
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rhiaro bret: That's what I was doing
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bret would be cool if media wiki could add a comment box for this situation
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rhiaro Aha, working with subsections is way better
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rhiaro on save it jumps back to the anchor, so no more ctrl+f-ing for headers..
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Loqi Akuckart made 8 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82271&oldid=82258
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82266&oldid=82265
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Loqi Bret made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82270&oldid=82261
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Loqi Rhiaro made 7 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82278&oldid=82271
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aaronpk yes editing subsections is way better
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bret i feel like an etherpad would work better for this
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Loqi Rhiaro made 6 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82288&oldid=82278
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Loqi Bret made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82284&oldid=82279
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aaronpk i'm not gonna finish going through all of them before the call
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rhiaro Me neither at this rate
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rhiaro Though I'm starting to think that almost all situations can be generalised to tagging something
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rhiaro I'm a big fan of tagging
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aaronpk me too!
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bret im the worst at tagging
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Loqi Rhiaro made 8 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82299&oldid=82288
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Loqi Bret made 3 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82298&oldid=82289
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AnnB just read thru the Loqi log ... looks like we're all swimming upstream against the deadline
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tantek AnnB: why do you say that?
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AnnB ends tonight, right?
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tantek midnight EST
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tantek per w3c convention
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AnnB right; it's well-defined
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AnnB it's just that we have so many user stories, it takes a long time
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AnnB I'm by far not the only one who has observed this
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tantek AnnB - if you're not sure, -1 it and move onto the next one ;)
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Loqi Rhiaro made 9 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82313&oldid=82299
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Loqi Bret made 5 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82311&oldid=82300
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tantek AnnB: depends on how thorough you want to be
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AnnB BTW, where are your votes?
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tantek aaronpk is doing all his voting from his website
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AnnB I have to think about it ... I'm just not that fast
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AnnB well, he's clearly a hotdog
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aaronpk lol
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tantek AnnB: started from the top, seeing how long it takes me to be detailed
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AnnB speaking of which, I was surprised @aaronpk, that you referred to loqi as a "he"
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AnnB I realize it's your tool, so you can apply any gender you want
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aaronpk there has been some discussion on the matter
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AnnB but, in my brain, it was not a he ... haha
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AnnB my experience with older men (way older than you), is that they often refer to computers as male
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AnnB thus my ears are primed for that :-)
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AnnB in this case, it wasn't a conscious thing .. I don't usually ascribe gender to inanimate objects ... so it caught my eye
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AnnB I like those logs a lot, btw
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AnnB really helpful to read what went on while one was out
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tantek AnnB good IRC logs are essential to IRC being useful and usable.
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tantek and a good way to make IRC better than email
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AnnB I totally agree
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ben_thatmustbeme sits quietly watching voting and twitddles his thumbs
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tantek IRC is so much better than reading through all the long-winded essays on the email list that should be people's blog posts on their own sites intead.
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tantek s/intead/instead
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AnnB observes ben_thatmustbeme gloating
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ben_thatmustbeme re: loqi as he: I always think of loqi and Loki, thus would be He
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tantek what ben_thatmustbeme said
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tantek this voting exercise has been excellent wiki editing practice, especially for those who email more than IRC/wiki.
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AnnB I wondered if there was a derivation of that name
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aaronpk Loqi is 6 and a half years old, and has had a mostly genderless existence, but has had occasional male traits
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Loqi Bret made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82326&oldid=82313
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Loqi Rhiaro made 9 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82327&oldid=82314
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aaronpk but yes the name is a derivation of Loki
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harry waves
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tantek good morning harry
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Loqi Bret made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82331&oldid=82328
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Loqi Rhiaro made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82334&oldid=82327
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Loqi Abasset made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82330&oldid=82329
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harry tantek, it seems like there are still edits on the wiki :)
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harry So I suggest we mainly discuss next steps re the stories, there's some controversials
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harry The question should be how to transform the stories into requirements
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harry and then how to get the WG to work together on one or more candidate APIs around those requirements, ideally based on existing work (rather than whiteboarding)
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tantek harry - of course there are still edits - the deadline is midnight EST tonight for voting.
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tantek harry - please add to the agenda if you have specific discussion topics in mind for the telcon
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2015-02-24#Agenda
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harry Just added some 'next steps' details to the stories
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rhiaro sooo close to being done with voting!
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Loqi Rhiaro made 4 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82340&oldid=82334
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Loqi Bblfish made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82339&oldid=82338
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Loqi Hhalpin made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/2015-02-24]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82342&oldid=81960
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82345&oldid=82337
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/2015-02-24]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82344&oldid=82342
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Loqi Bret made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82343&oldid=82340
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harry trackbot, start meeting
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trackbot is preparing a teleconference.
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RRSAgent logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/02/24-social-irc
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trackbot RRSAgent, make logs public
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RRSAgent I have made the request, trackbot
Zakim joined the channel
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trackbot Zakim, this will be SOCL
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Zakim ok, trackbot; I see T&S_SOCWG()1:00PM scheduled to start now
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trackbot Meeting: Social Web Working Group Teleconference
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trackbot Date: 24 February 2015
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harry Zakim, code?
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Zakim the conference code is 7625 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), harry
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tantek dialing
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harry dialin
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Zakim T&S_SOCWG()1:00PM has now started
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Zakim +bblfish
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cwebber dialing also
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Zakim +Arnaud
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tantek is still dialing, try # 3
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rhiaro Hmm Zakim doesn't seem to want to talk to me today
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Zakim +aaronpk
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tantek rhiaro keep trying
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cwebber2 here neither :\
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cwebber2 I might have to phone-dial
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tantek hmm - got the Ralph voice and dialed code, then Zakim hung up
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rhiaro It's just silent, I'm not even getting the 'welcome'
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tantek rhiaro redial
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aaronpk took me a couple tries
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Zakim + +1.617.247.aaaa
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tantek zakim must know it's about to be retired
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rhiaro This is new. I keep trying.
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ben_thatmustbeme Zakim, aaaa is me
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Zakim +ben_thatmustbeme; got it
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Zakim +??P8
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tantek zakim, ??p8 is me
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Zakim +tantek; got it
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ben_thatmustbeme Zakim, mute me
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Zakim ben_thatmustbeme should now be muted
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Zakim +??P3
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Zakim + +1.857.445.aabb
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eprodrom Zakim, who is on the call?
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Zakim On the phone I see bblfish, Arnaud, aaronpk, ben_thatmustbeme (muted), tantek, ??P3, +1.857.445.aabb
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eprodrom Zakim, ??P3 is eprodrom
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Zakim +eprodrom; got it
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harry Zakim, aabb is harry
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Zakim +harry; got it
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Zakim +??P2
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bret Zakim, ??P2 is me
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Zakim +bret; got it
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harry looks like critical mass
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bret Zakim: mute me
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bret Zakim, mute me
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Zakim bret should now be muted
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tantek anyone else having trouble calling in?
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Zakim +??P5
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bret shakes fist at the person who used , instead of :
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Zakim hears ??P5's hand up
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Zakim sees ??P5 on the speaker queue
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cwebber2 tantek: I'm having trouble
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Zakim + +1.408.335.aacc
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rhiaro Zakim, ??P5 is me
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Zakim +rhiaro; got it
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cwebber2 I'm going to try my phone once it boots, but SIP is not working.
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rhiaro Zakim, mute me
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Zakim rhiaro should now be muted
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harry maybe SIP is down :(
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rhiaro IRC client crashed when I connected >.>
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KevinMarks 1.408.335.aacc is me
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rhiaro is connect via sip now, seems fine
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harry Zakim, aacc is KevinMarks
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Zakim +KevinMarks; got it
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rhiaro famous last words
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aaronpk chair: tantek
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harry chair: tantek
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rhiaro It's okay, my client logs too
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harry even better!
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Zakim +??P10
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eprodrom Hooray for aaronpk
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harry scribenick: aaronpk
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harry scribe: aaronpk
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bret aaronpk++
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tantek zakim, who is here?
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Zakim On the phone I see bblfish, Arnaud, aaronpk, ben_thatmustbeme (muted), tantek, eprodrom, harry, bret (muted), rhiaro (muted), KevinMarks, ??P10
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Loqi aaronpk has 713 karma
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harry thanks aaron!
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Zakim On IRC I see bill-looby, Zakim, RRSAgent, eprodrom, Augier, harry, bblfish, tantek, AnnB, timbl, jaywink, melvster, KevinMarks, ben_thatmustbeme, shepazu, Arnaud, cwebber2,
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Zakim ... wseltzer, mattl, JakeHart, bret, wilkie, Loqi, dwhly, nickstenn, bigbluehat, rhiaro, oshepherd, rektide, Tsyesika, aaronpk, trackbot
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bill-looby Zakim,+??P10 is me
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Zakim sorry, bill-looby, I do not recognize a party named '+??P10'
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aaronpk agenda: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2015-02-24#Agenda
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tantek Zakim, ??P10 is bill-looby
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Zakim +bill-looby; got it
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bret you have to omit the +
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bill-looby thanks !
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rhiaro tantek, careful Zakim will hear you!
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aaronpk TOPIC: minutes from last week
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Zakim +Ann
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2015-02-17-minutes
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aaronpk Zakim can hear everything
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aaronpk tantek: any objections? otherwise I move to approve them
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eprodrom +1
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aaronpk ... any +1s on the minutes?
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aaronpk my +1 finger is tired
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cwebber2 +1
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eprodrom ha ha
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ben_thatmustbeme +1
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Zakim +Sandro
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Zakim +??P12
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eprodrom My -0 finger is tired
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aaronpk ...minutes approved not seeing any objections
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Tsyesika Zakim, ??P12 is me
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Zakim +Tsyesika; got it
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AnnB laughs at @eprodrom
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Tsyesika Zakim, mute me
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Zakim Tsyesika should now be muted
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aaronpk TOPIC: next week's telcon
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aaronpk tantek: scheduled for the 3rd, Arnaud will be chairing
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aaronpk ... next f2f is coming up on march 17th
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Loqi I added a countdown for 3/17 12:00am (#5639)
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2015-03-17#Participation
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aaronpk ... there are 10 people RSVPd, please RSVP to the meeting ASAP
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aaronpk ...book your travel and such
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aaronpk ...ify you want to participate remotely there is a section for th that as well
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aaronpk TOPIC: Annotation WG
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eprodrom q+
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Zakim sees ??P5, eprodrom on the speaker queue
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aaronpk tantek: I proposed in IRC that we formally invite any member of the annotation WG to considering attending our meeting as observer
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Loqi Abasset made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82350&oldid=82346
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Loqi Rhiaro made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82351&oldid=82345
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Loqi Bret made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82352&oldid=82347
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Loqi Sandro made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/2015-03-17]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82353&oldid=81716
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aaronpk ... observer means attending a WG meeting but is not a member, it doesn't mean they can't speak
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Zakim +[IPcaller]
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wilkie Zakim, IPcaller is me
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Zakim +wilkie; got it
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bblfish +1
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harry will do
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AnnB +1
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aaronpk ... since we'll be talking about the storeies at the f2f, invite the annotation members to the meeting
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rhiaro +1
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harry +1
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aaronpk q?
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Zakim sees ??P5, eprodrom on the speaker queue
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ben_thatmustbeme +1 sounds good to me, more input is better
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harry I'm not sure who is local, but I think if someone is that would be great
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wilkie +1
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rhiaro q-
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Zakim sees ??P5, eprodrom on the speaker queue
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tantek ack ??P5
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Zakim sees eprodrom on the speaker queue
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rhiaro oh I thought I was p5, I was trying to figure out who I was
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tantek ack next
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Zakim sees eprodrom at the head of the speaker queue
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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eprodrom Grrr not working
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eprodrom I'll pass
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tantek zakim, ??p5 is rhiaro
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Zakim I already had ??P5 as rhiaro, tantek
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eprodrom Just wanted to note that I think this was the subject of discussion at TPAC
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rhiaro shrugs
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eprodrom And I agree, +1
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eprodrom When we met with Annotations
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aaronpk tantek: harry can we action you to contact the annotation WG and extend an invitation on behalf of the social WG?
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aaronpk ... it'd be great to send their list an email directly to extend the invitation
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aaronpk ...don't need to make it a requirement but we shoudl make everyone feel welcome to contribute
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aaronpk harry: agree 100%
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eprodrom We have an F2F coming up, may be useful to have Annotators there
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harry ACTION: harry to invite Annotations WG
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trackbot is creating a new ACTION.
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RRSAgent records action 1
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trackbot Created ACTION-40 - Invite annotations wg [on Harry Halpin - due 2015-03-03].
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harry thats enough
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aaronpk tantek: anybody have anything to report on the tracker?
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aaronpk Arnaud: there were several new issues that were raised
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tantek new issues: http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/raised
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rhiaro has finished voting \o/
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aaronpk Issue 12: http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/12
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trackbot doesn't understand that ISSUE command.
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tantek http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/12
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KevinMarks got tired around 3am
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Zakim + +1.773.614.aadd
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aaronpk tantek: we raised this in last week's telcon
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bblfish Issue 12?
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trackbot doesn't understand that ISSUE command.
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aaronpk ...can we assume that if it was raised during a telcon that we can accept it?
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bblfish Issue 12
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trackbot doesn't understand that ISSUE command.
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Arnaud issue-12
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trackbot is looking up issue-12.
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trackbot issue-12 -- Action Types Structure and Processing Model -- raised
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trackbot http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/12
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aaronpk Arnaud: yeah you can propose we can open it if people agree
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cwebber2 Zakim, +1.773.614.aadd is me
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Zakim +cwebber2; got it
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aaronpk tantek: any objections to opening this issue?
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aaronpk Arnaud: what that means is we accept this is an issue we need to address
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aaronpk tantek: in general unless there are some extenuating circumstances, if a member of the WG opens an issue our default should be to accept and open it
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eprodrom +1 to open
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eprodrom AnnB: I just learned that, too!
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KevinMarks is this raise/catch?
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aaronpk is there a trackbot command to open an issue?
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tantek http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/13
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aaronpk tantek: issue 13
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Arnaud resolved: open issue-12 without objection
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aaronpk Which activity types are built into AS2, and how are they defined/structured?
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aaronpk ...this sounds like a good wiki doc kind of thing
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eprodrom Is this http://jasnell.github.io/w3c-socialwg-activitystreams/activitystreams2-vocabulary.html ?
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aaronpk ...where we document different implementations and publishing support
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eprodrom q+
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Zakim sees eprodrom on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ...i think we should accept and open it
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bblfish issue-13
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trackbot is looking up issue-13.
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trackbot issue-13 -- Which activity types are built into AS2, and how are they defined/structured? -- raised
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trackbot http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/13
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tantek ack eprodrom
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
timbl joined the channel
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aaronpk eprodrom: we have a vocab document for AS2 that does most of the mapping that eric is asking for
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aaronpk ...not sure if he had seen that document when he raised the issue or if i misunderstood his issue
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aaronpk AnnB: regardless that could just be an easy answer if that'st he case
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aaronpk tantek: evna I think this this different from just a mapping
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aaronpk ...it seems he is just asking for documentation on what AS2 publishers are actually publishing
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eprodrom Not in IRC
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aaronpk ...is erik on the call?
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AnnB s/that'st he/that's the/
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eprodrom +1 to raise and let's see if dret can confirm
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tantek quoting -- list of "well-known" activity types for AS2
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AnnB s/evna/evan/
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Loqi Bill-looby made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/2015-03-17]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82354&oldid=82353
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Loqi Sandro made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/2015-03-17]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82356&oldid=82354
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Loqi Rhiaro made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82358&oldid=82352
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bblfish issue-14
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trackbot is looking up issue-14.
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trackbot issue-14 -- as:Link adds a lot of complexity, if we keep it we need to clarify consequences of using it instead of as:Object -- raised
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trackbot http://www.w3.org/Social/track/issues/14
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aaronpk resolved: to open issue-13
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AnnB notes clever peeps able to multitask
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eprodrom I like that we can see who's editing the wiki during the teleconference
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rhiaro eprodrom there's big lag!
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aaronpk tantek: this seems like a reasonable issue to raise, any objections to opening it?
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eprodrom +1 to open
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aaronpk ...hearing no objections
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aaronpk rasolved: open issue-14
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aaronpk TOPIC: Social API User Stories
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aaronpk tantek: there's been al ot of discussion in various forms abotu that, people have been voting, which is even better
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aaronpk ...just a reminder, voting ends tonight at midnight EST
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KevinMarks lots to vote on
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eprodrom q+
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Zakim sees eprodrom on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ...since voting is stil going on, do we want to review any of the current voting results? or should we postpone until the voting period prefer?
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bill-looby q+
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Zakim sees eprodrom, bill-looby on the speaker queue
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tantek ack eprodrom
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Zakim sees bill-looby on the speaker queue
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harry q+
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Zakim sees bill-looby, harry on the speaker queue
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aaronpk eprodrom: just to let people know, there are around 90 stories on the page, it takes a long time to get through this
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rhiaro It took me 6 hours in a row today to do them all!
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aaronpk ...i split my time across 2-3 days, don't leave this til the last 5 minutes before midnight
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rhiaro is grateful to be able to have a schedule that accommodates this
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aaronpk ... because they're all on one page we can have edit conflicts. the best way to do it is to lcick edit on each individual story
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aaronpk ...to be less likely to have edit conflicts
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bblfish q+
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Zakim sees bill-looby, harry, bblfish on the speaker queue
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aaronpk tantek: excellent advice
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Zakim -Tsyesika
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aaronpk tantek: the other tip i saw go around was if you use ~~~~ it will sign your name and timestamp as well
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees bill-looby, harry, bblfish on the speaker queue
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tantek ack bill-looby
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Zakim sees harry, bblfish on the speaker queue
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Zakim +??P12
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Tsyesika Zakim, +??P12 is me
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Zakim sorry, Tsyesika, I do not recognize a party named '+??P12'
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aaronpk bill-looby: i noticed that everyone is lsing energy by the time they get to the last user story
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Tsyesika Zakim, ??P12 is me
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Zakim +Tsyesika; got it
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aaronpk ...might be a good idea for some people to start at the end
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AnnB smiles at this suggestion
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Tsyesika Zakim, mute me
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Zakim Tsyesika should now be muted
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rhiaro +1
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AnnB +1
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aaronpk ...the number of comments went down by the end, lots of just +1 +0 by the end
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aaronpk tantek: that's good advice. if people want to try voting from the bottom up as well as top down that'd be great
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aaronpk ...perhaps another strategy is to start with the stories that don't have a lot of comments yet
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AnnB it take a lot of time, but I really find the comments to be valuable
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aaronpk tantek: would like to suggest we postpone the discussion of process
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AnnB +1
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aaronpk ... would like to leave this open in peopels' minds while voting and not try to shape the votes in terms of an accepted process
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees harry, bblfish on the speaker queue
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bret +1
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aaronpk who is speaking?
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wilkie +1
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tantek bill-looby is speaking
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tantek or is that harry?
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AnnB sounds more like Harry
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bblfish +1 it makes sense because ew have a lot of -1s that can be controversial
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tantek yeah I think that might be harry on a better connection than usual
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aaronpk harry: as soon as the voting has ended, as chairs, we should go through the results before the next meeting, and imagine next ways forward.
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AnnB haha
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aaronpk ...i'd be doubtful if we can cover all in the API but that they might have some value in the future
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bret It would have been nice to see more effort to de-dupe some of these stories before voting
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AnnB (re: harry's connection)
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harry well I'm in the USA
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bblfish ack
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees harry, bblfish on the speaker queue
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harry but W3C still doesn't have a working phone on my desk, on mobile :)
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tantek ack harry
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Zakim sees bblfish on the speaker queue
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bblfish ack bblfish
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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harry that's it
timbl joined the channel
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aaronpk bblfish: there's lots of -1s, if it's taken that that's how we're misunderstanding each other. some people might say it's difficult... if we look at these votes as ways of judging how we can learn from each other then that's very positive
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aaronpk tantek: yeah i'd agree with that assessment. all the feedback we're getting is good because it's helping broaden our understanding
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AnnB totally agree
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aaronpk ...i don't expect us to use all the user stories to develop the api, but that being said, since each user story seems to be useful to multiple people, i think that means they are worty of continued iteration
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aaronpk ... if not in the first version then in additional versions or extnesions
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aaronpk ...this is all valuable input we're getting
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AnnB q+
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Zakim sees AnnB on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ...just because stories have a bunch of -1 it doesn't mean we're going to throw it out and never lookat it again
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tantek ack AnnB
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk AnnB: i totally agree, want to point out that in the case of the more "unusual" "obscure" stories,
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aaronpk ... often innovation happens at the edges
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Loqi Cwebber2 made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82359&oldid=82358
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aaronpk ... that's where different and unusual ideas occur
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KevinMarks if downvoting is seen as hostile we cut our range in half for +1 to -1 downt o +1 to 0
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rhiaro I think a lot of the more 'unusual' ones can be generalised, too, and are accommodated anyway
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... i'm loking forward to the discussion on the more unusual suggestions
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AnnB s/loking /looking /
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk tantek: since we have agreement on postponing the process of turning the stories into requiremetnts we've reached the end of the ageda
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aaronpk sorry for al lthe typos today
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aaronpk ...everyone is eager to get back to voting i'm guessing
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cwebber2 \o/
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AnnB no worries; grateful you are scribing!
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harry keep voting everyone!!
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aaronpk tantek: if there are no objections, would move to close the call and give back the remainder of the hour to continue voting!
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aaronpk Arnaud: one possiblity would be to pick up some user stories that are popular but are some objections, and maybe we can clarify some of them now
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aaronpk tantek: okay that's reasonable
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aaronpk AnnB: do you have ones you want to highlight?
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aaronpk Arnaud: there were some with major numbers of +1 and then a -1 from tantek
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aaronpk ...the very first one, user profile management
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#User_profile_management
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ben_thatmustbeme +1 i would like to be able to iterate on some of these stories or propose alternate versions
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aaronpk tantek: in having lookde at this, I agreed with most of the user story, but some of the fields used for profile management seemed to be very specific and not necessarily needed or present in the APIs we reviewed
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bblfish q+
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Zakim sees bblfish on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ...i agree with the general theme but had some specifics i was objecting to
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AnnB q+
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB on the speaker queue
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eprodrom q+
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB, eprodrom on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ...perhaps evan can clarify?
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bill-looby have to drop, bfn
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Zakim -bill-looby
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB, eprodrom on the speaker queue
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rhiaro My reading of that was that the specific profile data is arbitrary, and those given are just examples
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tantek ack eprodrom
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB on the speaker queue
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AnnB me too, rhiaro
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aaronpk eprodrom: hometown - it gets down to what you think the location field on twitter is for
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aaronpk ... it's kind of up in the air. facebook has a way to say this is where i'm from or this is where i live
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aaronpk ... job title and company name we have in linked in
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aaronpk ... those are pretty common
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aaronpk ... job title is pretty common in enterprise networks
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aaronpk ... phone number is in facebook and linkedin, most enterprise networks
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rhiaro hah, facebook doesn't have my phone number for sure
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rhiaro or anything else for that matter..
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aaronpk ... i've also seen some systems where you can update private data
timbl joined the channel
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aaronpk ... as far as the specifics, i think that would be up to how the profile works and up to the individual APIs we get proposals for
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aaronpk ... whether they use a fixed vocab for the profile or changed by the implementation
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AnnB +1 to rhiaro
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aaronpk ...but the idea that we are able to be able to update muliple parts of the profile is important
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rhiaro +1 updating multiple elements of profile, but not requiring specific fields
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aaronpk tantek: that makes more sense to me especially the last thing you said, updating parts or mnultiple aspects of the profile
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AnnB s/muliple/multiple/
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aaronpk ... that I agree with in a +1 way
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aaronpk ...but that feels like some of the aspects may be getting into profile vocab design which i would like to avoid
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aaronpk ... would rather reuse all notion of profile vocab from an existing standard like vcard 4
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aaronpk ... and looked at existing networks while that was devloped
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AnnB s/devloped/developed/
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Zakim +Sandro.a
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aaronpk ... i would +1 the profile management if it mentioned that the fields are used as examples and it's up to the service what field it supports
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aaronpk eprodrom: i think we can get into some interesting fine points
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bblfish q+
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... for example if you have a client that tries to update fields that aren't on the server
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aaronpk ... if the client doesn't understand the profile response from the server how should it handle it
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Zakim -Sandro
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aaronpk ... those are good discussions to have around the user stories
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tantek ack?
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eprodrom q?
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB on the speaker queue
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees bblfish, AnnB on the speaker queue
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tantek ack bblfish
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Zakim sees AnnB on the speaker queue
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sandro Zakim, Sandro.a is Sandro
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Zakim +Sandro; got it
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aaronpk bblfish: this shows a little of a confusion between the API and the data format
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bblfish http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/pim/contact#
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aaronpk ... because if you take the data format carefully like JSON LD then it's extensible
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KevinMarks look at existing profiles for intersection, rather than union
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bblfish http://www.w3.org/People/Berners-Lee/card
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harry q+
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Zakim sees AnnB, harry on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... you could use the contact ontology like timbl does for his profile, but it doesn't have to be part of this WG to describe all the ontologies
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KevinMarks opensocial went for union, which meant we ended up with too many fields
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aaronpk ... so i read it that there is no requirement for the WG to specify the ontology, just that the API be able to edit the information as needed
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aaronpk ... i've seen this type of example where people get caught up on the API vs the schema
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees AnnB, harry on the speaker queue
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tantek ack AnnB
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Zakim sees harry on the speaker queue
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aaronpk AnnB: i think this was largely resolved so far but hasd one concern
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aaronpk ... "well twitter and instagram don't have it so it's unnecessary" seems like a narrow perspective
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aaronpk ... doesn't necessarily mean that the whole world doesn't need it, especially in enterprise it varies significantly
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aaronpk tantek: if something is not ever-present then it's probably not core. it's okay to consider more complex cases, i'm focused on getting out a v1 of the api
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aaronpk ... the extensibility henry described is the kindof thinking i'm hoping goes into the api byt didn't want to assume that
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rhiaro +1 for not defining everything, and helping servers have decent fallbacks instead when they don't understand things
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aaronpk ... i asked for clarification from evan about whether this is specifying specific fields or leaving things a bit more open
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aaronpk ...and then define rules for publishers and consumers handling support for different fields
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aaronpk ... evan is that a reasonable summary?
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aaronpk eprodrom: i think it is up for discussion
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bblfish +1 for tantek's description of the two approaches - I am for having an API that can work with any data ( though the working group could decide on a minimal yet extensible ontology that all clients should understand )
#
aaronpk ... my feeling is that we want to use some vocabulary in there, i'd probably wnat to use a well-known vocab here to make things easier for implementers
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aaronpk AnnB: this seems like a valuaable discussion, it's foundational to how this goes forward
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aaronpk tantek: to be clear my +0 is not an opposition
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AnnB s/valuaable/valuable/
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees harry on the speaker queue
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tantek ack harry
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk harry: we do have a requirement that we will use the IG input as a building point
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aaronpk ... regardless of how big the union/intersection of terms in the API becomes, i would be shocked if we did not have some extensibility mechanism
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rhiaro +1 extensibility
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aaronpk AnnB: that's a good point about the IG but i will need to understand that better
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk harry: as soon as we get a v1 of teh API that peopel agree on, people will notice "it doesn't quite fit my use case" do we need to create another vocab or format and can send it to teh IG to continue working on
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Zakim -cwebber2
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aaronpk tantek: i strongly agree with intersection instead of union
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cwebber2 phone died, sorry
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bblfish as long as things are extensible.
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aaronpk AnnB: since i'm not a developer, i'm having a hard time assessing what goes into the API instead of UI or some other mechanism
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bblfish q+
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Zakim sees bblfish on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... you who are developers can guide me that way
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees bblfish on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... it's too bad Adam got pulled out this week
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aaronpk ?? that discussion of what goes into an API vs UI could go on for hours
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tantek ack bblfish
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... i certainly encourage people to discuss that in IRC but not sure it's worth taking time in the telcon
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AnnB agree .. just pointing out this is a aspect of confusion for me
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bblfish https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#Developing_a_Smart_client
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AnnB s/a aspect / an aspect /
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aaronpk bblfish: what it's trying to say is most of what's published is data, and the client uses the data to create the user interface
#
aaronpk ... and then the API is how you change the data, how you create new data, that's my way of seeing the three layers
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AnnB thanks Henry
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aaronpk ... API, data and user interface
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk tantek: okay
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aaronpk ... anyone else want to bring up any questions?
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#User_posts_a_note_with_embedded_media
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aaronpk ... use posts a note with embedded media
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AnnB s/pulled out this week/pulled out this week, since he's my local developer 'explainer'/
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aaronpk tantek: there is a challenge ... it's not clear whether video embedding is done simply via a URL or where it's something where you upload a video
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aaronpk ... based on the two interpretations i have completely opposite votes
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eprodrom q+
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Zakim sees eprodrom on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... simply pasting a URL, having auto-embedding is a pretty common feature, i've even implemented it on my site
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rhiaro In my experience video uploading comes with a ton of extra baggage, or at least tends to require additional metadata
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aaronpk ... but a -1 for making video uploads a core part of the api
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cwebber2 really?
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aaronpk ... so are jessica or christopher here to clarify the intent?
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bret rhiaro: ever had to maintain a dedicated ffmpeg server ;)
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harry ?
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cwebber2 hold on
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees eprodrom on the speaker queue
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cwebber2 I dropped off the call but I have to reconnect
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tantek ack eprodrom
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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cwebber2 +q
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Zakim sees cwebber on the speaker queue
#
Loqi Kmarks2 made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82362&oldid=82359
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aaronpk eprodrom: first, this becomes a more mainstream user story if it's an image used in a text, so the flow of posting an image and putting it int he text and sharing that
#
Zakim +cwebber2
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aaronpk ... the other thing is sounds like your -1 for video, but a lot of the folks from mediagoblin are here and doing sharing media
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees cwebber on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... audio and video and images
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tantek ack cwebber2
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Zakim sees cwebber on the speaker queue
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Tsyesika I'm here but i don't have a mic so i'll let chris take this
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tantek ack cwebber
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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ben_thatmustbeme q+
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Zakim sees ben_thatmustbeme on the speaker queue
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aaronpk cwebber2: i think that media upload, wit's not true that the service should be required to handle large media upload, but the api should be designed so that we know how this would work
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aaronpk ... it would be surprising to me if we don't have a way to define here is how we handle large uploads
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rhiaro Would be good if you could upload your video to one server and embed it in a post simultaneously... Seems like something the API could help with
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rhiaro s/in a post/in a post on a different server
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aaronpk ... it's okay if services say it's not possible to handle certain formats
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aaronpk tantek: the reason i was not sure about this was that this story specifically mentioned someone else's video
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aaronpk ... so samantha is writing a post and embeds helen's video, my optimistic interpretation was that samantha puts in a URL to the video
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wilkie is there an ability to replicate media for reposting?
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aaronpk ... but then I realized perhaps this was meant ot cover video uploading
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aaronpk ... i agree it would be good to have a user story on video uploading, but this seems more like sharing a link to something online
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aaronpk cwebber2: that user story we submitted was about sharing a link to something already online
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aaronpk ... i thought that other user stories had already covered video uploading
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aaronpk ... it looked like there was a question about whether video uploading should be able to happen at all
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aaronpk ... i do think that submitting video, even though that's not hte user sotry in question, is important. sorry if there was confusion, my phone screwed up
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AnnB dang phones!
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aaronpk tantek: so the "user posts a note with embedded media" is about sharing existing video already online
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aaronpk cwebber2: exactly
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rhiaro Note: Vine is a social network based entirely on sharing video, so definitely required for social..
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aaronpk tantek: okay that clarifies that one
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#User_posts_a_note_with_embedded_media
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aaronpk can someone update the wiki with that
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#User_posts_a_file
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees ben_thatmustbeme on the speaker queue
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ben_thatmustbeme Zakim, unmute me
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Zakim ben_thatmustbeme should no longer be muted
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tantek ack ben_thatmustbeme
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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Arnaud someone needs to clarify the story so this is no longer ambiguous
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cwebber2 Zakim, mute me
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Zakim cwebber2 should now be muted
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aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: should we use the "more stories" page to try to clarify these?
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aaronpk ... should we be constantly making new ones to say here is my interpretation of these stories
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aaronpk tantek: i think that's a great idea, it will help us converge on user stories
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aaronpk ... the "more users" stories page is...
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tantek https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/More_user_stories
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AnnB q+
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Zakim sees AnnB on the speaker queue
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aaronpk ... there's nothing on there now, but that's a great suggestion
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aaronpk ... one way of clarifying a story or clarifying your vote
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ben_thatmustbeme Zakim, mute me
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Zakim ben_thatmustbeme should now be muted
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aaronpk ... you can say "+1 on this assuming..." and link to your interpretation
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees AnnB on the speaker queue
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tantek ack AnnB
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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eprodrom Approaching the hour, btw, tantek
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tantek eprodrom yup, watching
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harry I warned people re the stories :)
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aaronpk AnnB: i think tha'ts a great suggestion but i'm worried that there are so many of these stories that its going to be a nightmare to go back and forth between all the versions
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ben_thatmustbeme that was my concern at all
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aaronpk ... is there a way we can discuss this more diretly inline?
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aaronpk tantek: people have been doing that already
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aaronpk ... ben's proposal was an additional option to people
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aaronpk AnnB: i'm totally supporting the concept of further discussion, just worried that if we birfurcate this then how we're going to track it
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aaronpk tantek: hopefully with links
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aaronpk AnnB: links are great but they can also be confusing
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tantek q?
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Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
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aaronpk tantek: we're approaching the top of the hour
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aaronpk ... there's no end to discussing the details of these stories
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aaronpk ... for the "posts a file" did you mean photo only or any kind of media file or any kind of file?
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aaronpk https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#User_posts_a_file
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AnnB s/tha'ts a /that's a /
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aaronpk eprodrom: from the original requirements, we had images,text,video,audio,enterprise docs and other types
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aaronpk ... so that user story was supposed to summarize those groups
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aaronpk ... we could break it down to multiple groups
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Loqi Rhiaro made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82363&oldid=82362
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Loqi Eprodrom made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82364&oldid=82363
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aaronpk ... iwas trying to take from the original user requirements around 10 high-level areas, one for each
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AnnB s/diretly /directly /
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aaronpk ... so that "upload a file" became "upload an image"
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aaronpk ... as far as cropping, the idea was the user was cropping is they'd use their own software like photoshop, not part of the API
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AnnB s/iwas /I was /
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aaronpk tantek: that's a good example of a reasonable clarification to add as bullet points as part of the description of the story
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AnnB +1 ... I like the small clarifications people have added .. it's helpful when they are indented
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aaronpk ... if you want to put a brief bullet list clarifying "crop is not intended to be part of the API" that's totally reasonable
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aaronpk ... i'd rather optimistically trust that people add clarifications to narrow the scope and won't abuse that
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aaronpk ... i would encourage folks, if you're seeing questions or objections on your story, you can clarify
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aaronpk eprodrom: that sounds fine
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aaronpk ... at this point i'd rather not change the formatting on the stories, we're hours away from finishing. but if people want to add additional bullet points that's great
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aaronpk tantek: any objections?
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rhiaro +1
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aaronpk resolved: if you're the author of the user story you may add clarifying comments in the voting area
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eprodrom +1
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harry +1
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aaronpk tantek: that brings us well past the top of the hour but hopefully that helps us get more consensus on user stories
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Zakim -Sandro
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aaronpk ... thanks again, we'll reconvene next week and figure out our next steps
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Zakim -bblfish
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rhiaro ciao!
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wilkie cool, thanks
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Zakim -Tsyesika
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eprodrom Thanks tantek !
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bblfish thanks
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bret cheers
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Zakim -cwebber2
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aaronpk whew
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Zakim -rhiaro
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Zakim -harry
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Zakim -Arnaud
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Zakim -KevinMarks
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Zakim -aaronpk
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Zakim -tantek
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Zakim -eprodrom
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Zakim -ben_thatmustbeme
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Zakim -Ann
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aaronpk Zakim, who was on the call?
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Zakim I don't understand your question, aaronpk.
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wilkie aaronpk++
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Zakim -wilkie
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Loqi aaronpk has 714 karma
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aaronpk trackbot, end meeting
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trackbot is ending a teleconference.
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trackbot Zakim, list attendees
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Zakim As of this point the attendees have been bblfish, Arnaud, aaronpk, +1.617.247.aaaa, ben_thatmustbeme, tantek, +1.857.445.aabb, eprodrom, harry, bret, +1.408.335.aacc, rhiaro,
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Zakim ... KevinMarks, bill-looby, Ann, Sandro, Tsyesika, wilkie, cwebber2
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trackbot RRSAgent, please draft minutes
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RRSAgent I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/02/24-social-minutes.html trackbot
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trackbot RRSAgent, bye
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tantek aaronpk++ for scribing!
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RRSAgent I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/24-social-actions.rdf :
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bret AnnB: if you ever want to drop Developer questions into IRC i can try to answer from what I know
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RRSAgent ACTION: harry to invite Annotations WG [1]
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Loqi aaronpk has 715 karma
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RRSAgent recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/02/24-social-irc#T18-13-22
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aaronpk omg the bots are going mad
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tantek thanks bret
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Zakim -bret
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Zakim T&S_SOCWG()1:00PM has ended
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Zakim Attendees were bblfish, Arnaud, aaronpk, +1.617.247.aaaa, ben_thatmustbeme, tantek, +1.857.445.aabb, eprodrom, harry, bret, +1.408.335.aacc, rhiaro, KevinMarks, bill-looby, Ann,
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Zakim ... Sandro, Tsyesika, wilkie, cwebber2
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AnnB thanks bret!
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ben_thatmustbeme likewise AnnB, there are plenty of us that may be able to help clarify things
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AnnB you guys are great!
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tantek thanks ben_thatmustbeme !
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bret and if I dont have a good answer it might http://xkcd.com/386/ others into helping out
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aaronpk now i have to remember the magic incantations
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tantek AnnB - you've got developers here willing to help with questions :)
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AnnB smiling
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AnnB really looking forward to the F2F
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tantek aaronpk: https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg#Scribes
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ben_thatmustbeme bret++ , xkcd at the ready
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Loqi bret has 50 karma
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AnnB and the IndieWeb gathering (at least I can be there for most of Thursday)
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AnnB hehe on xkcd
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rhiaro AnnB: great that you can come!
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AnnB will be really fun to see YOU again, rhiaro
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ben_thatmustbeme still don't know how somone talked me in to co-organizing that
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AnnB hope the dang snow melts ... yikers
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AnnB you're probly a special guy
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AnnB at least we can hope it's above freezing ...
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: you're close( r ) to the venue for the IWC
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Loqi Aaronpk made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/2015-02-24-minutes]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82365&oldid=0
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ben_thatmustbeme Yeah, i know I am
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ben_thatmustbeme Now i just need to go through and start revising some user stories when I have time.
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tantek you mean clarifying with comments right? ;)
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ben_thatmustbeme i mean adding versions of ones that aren't mine
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ben_thatmustbeme to hopefully clear up ambiguity
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tantek oh nice - in the more_user_stories
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ben_thatmustbeme even if there are comments clearing it up or people's responses, it would be good to have a version that clears up the issue
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ben_thatmustbeme I just agree with AnnB, it may get to be too much, but at the very least it could be something for chairs to look at when selecting user stories to base off of
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ben_thatmustbeme almost a "yes this user story got accepted but maybe this version is the one we should use as it is unambiguous"
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ben_thatmustbeme I found the problem in voting was there was no distinction between bad user stories vs functionality that should not be in the core
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: agreed, writing simplified derivative / replacement user-stories is an excellent way to provide constructive critical feedback
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tantek as a co-chair I for one will be strongly considering those in light of any -1s made on user-stories
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tantek that is, if someone makes a -1 and provides a subset or corrected version of the user-story as a replacement / alternative, I think it adds a lot more weight to the -1
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tantek but it's certainly not required for a -1
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tantek the point is that even if you -1 a user story, if you provide a "fixed" version that you think the others voting on the original would still find acceptable, then you're actively working to achieve consensus
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tantek and the chairs look kindly upon efforts to achieve consensus
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rhiaro I have just confirmed somewhere to stay for my first few nights in Cambridge before the f2f, but now looking for places 17th to 25th, if anyone knows anyone with a spare couch :)
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rhiaro Or if anyone wants to share super cheap airbnb etc
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ben_thatmustbeme rhiaro, as offerent previously, can crash at our place, but its a train ride in to the city every day, $10 each way :/
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ben_thatmustbeme s/offerenet/offered/
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rhiaro thanks ben_thatmustbeme, noted! I'm doing some cursory scouting currently
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ben_thatmustbeme we'll just cancel the crazy parties for that week :P
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Loqi Bblfish made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/More user stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82367&oldid=81714
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ben_thatmustbeme bblfish, just almost stepped on each other editting that page :)
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/More user stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82368&oldid=82367
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Zakim excuses himself; his presence no longer seems to be needed
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 2 edits to [[Socialwg/Social API/More user stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82376&oldid=82372
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/More user stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82377&oldid=82376
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82378&oldid=82374
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/More user stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82379&oldid=82377
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ben_thatmustbeme bblfish, I would suggest linking user stories in both directs, hopefully alleviate some of the concerns AnnB had of managing multiple versions. I share them as well
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ben_thatmustbeme s/directs/directions/
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Loqi Benthatmustbeme made 1 edit to [[Socialwg/Social API/User stories]] https://www.w3.org/wiki/index.php?diff=82380&oldid=82378
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